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inédito Malvinas 1982: ¿cómo y por qué?
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El Malvinense
Verdad Justicia Libertad


Registrado: 19 May 2008
Mensajes: 474
Ubicación: Argentina

MensajePublicado: Vie Feb 11, 2011 5:23 pm    Asunto: inédito Malvinas 1982: ¿cómo y por qué? Responder citando

Cada viernes, un golpe a la mentira, un golpe a la traición...

Ahora que todos han hablado.
Ahora que parece que todo está dicho.
Ahora que ellos están tranquilos.
Ahora parece que nada hay por agregar.
Ahora que el triunfo parece ser absoluto.
Ahora que han logrado que la verguenza, la pena y el olvido nos inunden.
Ahora.
En este preciso momento, 29 años después.
Ahora,
es el tiempo de la VERDAD

Alberto De Vita


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"Tres cosas guardan la unidad: la paciencia, la humildad y la caridad."

http://www.malvinense.com.ar
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El Malvinense
Verdad Justicia Libertad


Registrado: 19 May 2008
Mensajes: 474
Ubicación: Argentina

MensajePublicado: Jue Mar 31, 2011 5:31 pm    Asunto: Responder citando


_________________
"Tres cosas guardan la unidad: la paciencia, la humildad y la caridad."

http://www.malvinense.com.ar
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El Malvinense
Verdad Justicia Libertad


Registrado: 19 May 2008
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Ubicación: Argentina

MensajePublicado: Vie Abr 01, 2011 1:05 pm    Asunto: Responder citando

ESTO ES ÚNICO Y SE BASA EN TODOS DOCUMENTOS BRITÁNICOS... NO HAY NADA DEJADO AL AZAR...

PARA LOS DESMALVINIZADORES, PARA LOS SUCIOS CIPAYOS Y TRAIDORES...

VIVA LA PATRIA!!

MALVINAS VOLVEREMOS!!!!


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"Tres cosas guardan la unidad: la paciencia, la humildad y la caridad."

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MARIANO



Registrado: 05 Dic 2008
Mensajes: 110
Ubicación: BS AS

MensajePublicado: Sab Abr 02, 2011 1:05 am    Asunto: Responder citando

MUY BUENO AMIGO!!!!!!!!!!!!TE MANDO UN ABRAZO,Y FELIZ DIA MALVINENSE
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SIEMPRE FUERON NUESTRAS,SIEMPRE LO SERAN.
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JPL



Registrado: 19 May 2008
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Ubicación: CABA

MensajePublicado: Lun Sep 26, 2011 11:24 pm    Asunto: Responder citando

ESTA INVESTIGACION ES DE LAS MAS COMPLETAS Y BRILLANTES POR SUS CONCLUSIONES Y PRUEBAS.

CREO QUE MERECERIA SER UN LIBRO.

¡ FELICITACIONES !

JPL

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‎"La espada que se desenvaina con honor, se conserva inmaculada cuando hiere y mata, porque hace del sufrimiento y de la muerte servidores de la Justicia"
( J.B.GENTA )
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JPL



Registrado: 19 May 2008
Mensajes: 1574
Ubicación: CABA

MensajePublicado: Mie Sep 28, 2011 1:06 pm    Asunto: Responder citando

Transcribo un interesante dialogo, sobre el tema del topic, con britanicos del sitio "Mercopress":



1 JPL (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 05:51 pm
The same predatory nature of the whole history of UK. For centuries they have been doing the same all over the world. In 1982, Britain provoked the war irresponsibly.Today the British still do not listen to requests for negotiation because they do not care anything at all to fall into another war, what matters to the UK, is money, not peace.

3 stick up your junta (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 06:23 pm
In 1982, Britain provoked the war
Even you dont believe that, do ya?

11 JPL (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 07:48 pm
3 stick up your junta
If Argentina allowed the workers in Georgia were expelled, had recognized the sovereignty of Britain over the disputed territory. The British threat to expel Argentine workers of South Georgia in March 1982, was contested by Argentina with the expulsion of the British military in the Falklands, regaining sovereignty.
And internal uk factors:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeiNg_PrP_0&feature=channel_video_title

12 stick up your junta (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 08:29 pm
Nice try JPL
The Argentine intervention had begun on 19 March, when a group of civilian scrap metal workers illegally arrived at Leith Harbour on board the transport ship ARA Bahía Buen Suceso and raised the Argentine flag. The scrap workers had been infiltrated by Argentine marines posing as civilian scientists.[1][2]

14 JPL (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 09:45 pm
good “copy and paste” stick, but the information is wrong. The British embassy was aware of everything, because they were informed by Davidoff and had dealt with the “white card”. The 41 workers involved in dismantling the whaling station, were not military, civilians, in addition, many were not even in Argentina. The Good Success Bay was not an armed ship was a transport, and was chosen because it was the only one available. He even offered to take supplies to the British station of BAS Where is the aggression and invasion here? UK threatens to forcibly evict ordinary workers, and if permitted Argentina, recognized the uk sovereignty (nonexistent). The Argentine military landed in Georgia to further protect workers and prevent them from being forcibly removed.

16 Beef (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 10:02 pm
Can someone point out how the UK provoked the 1982 conflict. I thought it was a cynical and desperate move by an unpopular military dictatorship to raise it's internal image?
Then only thing we did in 1982 was to end the conflict by forcing Menendez to sign the surrender document (especially embarrrsing as Argentine military code should have prevented Menendez into surrendering).
There is nothing to negotiate. Keep the drill bit turning.



17 lost1 (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 10:06 pm
The Argies have been posting on here again ^. Shame they don't have anything intelligent to say.
My message to Argentina is, we are not going to be intimidated, you are in the wrong. The only course of action you have open to you is force and if you try that you will be destroyed, the UN will be forced to act against your country (irrespective of the despotic corrupt regimes you have enlisted there), the British Commonwealth will act against you, the EU will act against you, the US will act against you and NATO will act against you. Argentina will find itself with a lot more in common with the third world states it enlists support from, than it would wish.

18 JPL (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 10:10 pm
The response of “Beef” and “lost1” is exactly what I'm referring to. “We have nothing to negotiate” an attitude, very aggressive, provoked the war in 1982.

20 JPL (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 10:27 pm
I wonder what kind of education people get from here. Perhaps only see T.V. and grew up watching the “History Channel” or read wikiped.ia. Reading the comments on the causes of the war of 1982, I note that the knowledge is very basic, and when they run out of arguments ... born aggression.

21 Filippo (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 10:38 pm
20 JPL
Our history is a proud one in 1982 our military junta was still in process of ridding our nation of leftist youth, a process they did not complete. Growing political unrest in the country forced the military government to take action - action they should have take years before. This was the re-occupation of las malvinas.
We renamed all place names in las malvinas, made Spanish the official language, changed direction of traffic to right side, made it illegal to question the new regime, or oppose the military occupation.
We would have gon a lot futher and removed population by force, if it had not been for Mrs Thatchers response. We should have done this anyway. Forcing them into church halls for duration of war, was not enough for some. Terry Peck was example of what these traitors did to their liberators! Thankfully his son has realised his father was a traitor to Argentina, thankfully his father is pasted away many years ago, otherwise he would have to live with realisation of his treason against his country Argentina. These people are not Argentine though, they have no rights, they are not recongnised by our constitution, they are in illegal occupation of our land and must be removed.
Military junta in 1982 did not remove enough of political left, they are still a problem in our country today. 50,000 was not enough, they are many, especially Indians. With more will behind military we can take these islands again and solve finally las malvinas pirate problem!!!!!

25 Redhoyt (#)Sep 26th, 2011 - 11:27 pm
Davisdoff was working for the navy!
easy deduction - he did keep turning up in their ships.
“ 1981 - On December 20th, the scrap dealer Constantino Davidoff, lands briefly on South Georgia to assess the whaling station at Leith. Davidoff is a passenger on the Argentine Navy ice breaker, Almirante Irizar.

December 22nd, General Galtieri succeeds President Viola as President of Argentina. He also retains his position as Commander-in-Chief of the Army, which he is due to hold until the end of 1982.
On December 31st, the unauthorised presence of the Argentine icebreaker in British waters is notified to London.
[Davidoff was aware that both his and the icebreaker's presence at South Georgia required the prior permission of the Governor on the Falkland Islands. He had notified the Embassy in Buenos Aires of his visit but the letter did not arrive until after he had sailed.]...”
falklandstimeline.wordpress.com/1967-1981/
1982 - March 9th - Davidoff informs the British Embassy that he is sending a party of 41 workers to South Georgia under his contract with the owners of the derelict whaling station at Leith.
Davidoff is instructed to contact the British Antarctic Survey base at Grytviken on arrival.
The Bahia Buen Suceso is chartered from the Argentine navy for the salvage operation.
Christian Salvesen, confirms that the contract has been extended to March 31st, 1984.
March 19th - the Bahia Buen Suceso arrives at South Georgia but sails directly to Leith and does not report to the base at Grytviken. A large party of both civilian and military personnel land, shots are fired and the Argentine flag raised.
Following an exchange of messages between the Falklands and London, instructions are sent to the British Antarctic base at Grytviken to instruct the Argentine commander to lower the flag .....”
falklandstimeline.wordpress.com/1982-2/
Davidoff always knew ecaxtlt what he was doing !

26 JPL (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 12:02 am
Redhoyt: It is totally wrong, with workers Davidoff, not any military landing. The alleged “invasion” was not such, as an island is not invaded Georgia as only 14 soldiers and a transport ship. Obviously an invasion of an island like that. Need more people and material. The landing of the Marines (armed only with rifles) came after the UK threatened to use force to evict civilian workers (many of them were not born in Argentina). Since the start of hostilities UK with a threat of force, Argentina had no choice but to protect these workers. In addition, images of soldiers formed with a flag of Argentina in the wind (shown in most Anglo documentaries) correspond to the ceremony that took place on April 2 in South Georgia to celebrate the recovery of the Malvinas. These images are not the “landing” of the civilian workers of the employer Davidoff. You do not know?

28 lost1 (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 12:42 am
JPL (#)
My father was with the BAS on South Georgia when your armed scrap merchants (Marines) landed and raised the Argentine flag in February 1982!
Your scrap merchants needed to have got approval from the governor in Stanley, which they did not do). Britain spend the next 6 weeks pissing about trying to avoid creating an incident, bending over backwards. The British government hadn't figured they were dealing with lunatics!
The fact is South Georgia was a diversion, to get Endurance out of the way of the Falkland's for the main landing force on April 2nd. Although Endurance only had two 20 mm guns, she carried two Wessex helicopters armed with Sea Stuka missiles and therefore had the capability to sink your invasion force. If Endurance had still been on station, your landing force would have had to sink her or be confronted by her. In order to sink her you would have had to find her, not an easy job with Captain Baker in command.
It was a classic diversionary tactic, I studied the Falklands War for my masters in Defence Studies.
We don't have armed scrap merchants in the UK, going around to other peoples county and hoisting their national flag illegally. If we did they wouldn't last long! Only lunatic fascistic countries, who kill their own people have marines posing as scrap merchants.

31 Redhoyt (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 03:30 am
Good answer Lost1 (what happened to the other?)
Wouldn't mind a peek at that thesis ??
If willing, trcontact me via - falklandia.com/YForum/YaBB.pl

33 JPL (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 03:41 am
lost: Although you say your father was in the BAS in Georgia or did a master's degree in defense studies, is irrelevant because you can not prove to be true.The approval of the British governor of the islands was not necessary, because as everyone knows, Davidoff had informed everything about this commercial operation, including a detailed listing of the 41 workers who did not belong to the Argentine Navy, because were only civilians. The necessary documentation had, was the “white card”, which did not require any sealing, according to the “Agreement of Communications” 1971. And fewer still, they needed the “Argentine passport, or stamped seal of this. Unilaterally UK broke that agreement, and threatened to use force to evict ordinary workers. Moreover, the British Embassy had been thoroughly informed. The alleged ”diversionary tactic” you mentioned, is the view of everyone, not credible. because:
1. The cause was not convenient Argentina in April because the conflict was about to receive modern weapons (Exocets, super Etendards, etc). Also missing to complete the training of soldiers.
2. The Endurance had no helicopters equipped with Sea Skua missiles, only AS-12 missiles had therefore did not have any ability to successfully face Argentina's fleet.
3. In contrast, Britain was about to sell its aircraft and ships most important, the Royal Navy would become a “coast guard”. In addition to major problems in the government of Margaret Thatcher.As you can see, the country that he must cause a conflict, in April, was the United Kingdom, not Argentina.The raising of a small flag for that group of civilian workers, is not relevant, as it was immediately lowered, so that this small problem does not become a big problem. The major problem was the non-observance of “communication agreement” of 1971, and the threat of force to evict a group of workers. What caused Argentina's response.

39 Redhoyt (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 04:40 am
“ .. March 9th - Davidoff informs the British Embassy that he is sending a party of 41 workers to South Georgia under his contract with the owners of the derelict whaling station at Leith.
Davidoff is instructed to contact the British Antarctic Survey base at Grytviken on arrival.
The Bahia Buen Suceso is chartered from the Argentine navy for the salvage operation.
Christian Salvesen, confirms that the contract has been extended to March 31st, 1984.
March 19th - the Bahia Buen Suceso arrives at South Georgia but sails directly to Leith and does not report to the base at Grytviken. A large party of both civilian and military personnel land, shots are fired and the Argentine flag raised.
Following an exchange of messages between the Falklands and London, instructions are sent to the British Antarctic base at Grytviken to instruct the Argentine commander to lower the flag
The Argentine representative in London is summoned and told that the incident is regarded as serious and if the Argentine ship does not leave forthwith, the British Government will take whatever action seemed necessary. The same message is relayed to Argentina’s Foreign Ministry in Buenos Aires.
...”
Eye witnesses are normally counted as good evidence!
Raising the flag of another nation is entirely relevant within the context of the time.
Davidoff was the excuse!
Read and learn - falklandstimeline.wordpress.com/1982-2/

49 stick up your junta (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 09:19 am
@jpl
Argentine forces landed on Southern Thule - a barren, uninhabited dependency, more than 1,000 miles south of the islands - in late 1976 in a move mirroring the later occupation of South Georgia which preceded full invasion of the Falklands.
They set up an illegal “scientific” base manned by up to 50 “technicians” which remained until the defeat of Argentina in 1982.

55 lost1 (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 10:45 am
33 JPL
You have a lot of incorrect information. I can assure you Davidoff did not got through the correct entry procedures. It can be proved that his “scrap metal workers” were armed, they hunted Reindeer with them and were photographed with the weapons. They broke into BAS stores in Leith, helping themselves to survival stores. They raised the Argentine national flag and were openly hostile to BAS personnel. All this is well documented by the BAS and others.
In regards to the Royal Navy, it's true that Invincible and Hermes were scheduled to be sold but Illustrious and Ark Royal were months away from entering service to take their place, the end result would still be 2 carriers. In addition the plan to scrap the amphibious landing ships had been dropped, the UK would have maintained the same sized amphibious capability. Endurance was also probably going to be saved or replaced. There were plans to replace the Royal Marines barracks at Moody Brooke & enhance them. So a lot of what people believe to be common knowledge on these cuts at the time of the Falklands War, were incorrect and the result of hype by the media.
Argentina chose to invade in April, judging the weather to be acceptable enough for operations in the Falklands and South Georgia, hoping that by the time the UK responded (which they didn't believe likely), winter would have set in.
Argentina had been planning the invasion for over 6 months. Intelligence reports from Captain Barker visiting Argentine ports were passed on to the Foreign Office warning of plans as early as December 1981. The British Embassy in Buenas Aires also passed on reports. A number of people passed on reports of Argentine troop build ups. Any military operation of this scale would have required at the min several weeks to prepare, by forward positioning of weapons, stocks and the availability of ships and aircraft out of refit and repair. The anti-submarine exercise with Uruguay was planned well in advance aimed at

64 JustinKuntz (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 11:45 am
AH JPL or Juan Pablo Leronde of the El Malvinense crowd, the guy is a fruitcake who claims the Argentine Air Force shot down 60 Sea Harriers. (There were 47 at the time).
JPL, Davidoff's party was infiltrated by Marines disguised as workers. They paraded in uniform, raised the Argentine flag and they were armed. It was part of Admiral Anaya's plan to establish a base on South Georgia, like they had on Southern Thule. It was entirely an incident manufactured by Argentina to create a pretext for invasion. Britain did nothing to provoke anything and tried hard to find a peaceful way out, while dealing with a bunch of high strung lunatics led by a drunken president. Not only did they land marines with the workers, they later sent re-inforcements.
Lets not forget they also broke a solemn promise to remove the workers and take them to Grytviken to have their documents validated. Davidoff also mailed his papers after the workers had left for South Georgia.

82 Beef (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 05:20 pm
JPL - saying “we have nothing to negotiate” is not an aggressive position and certainly didn't provoke the 1982 conflict. The 1982 conflict was started by an Argentine invasion of the FI - that is an indesuptible fact.
Saying “we have nothing to negotiate” is simply our position and is neither aggressive or pacifistic, it is simply a position. We ate happy to negotiate many issues of collaboration with Argentina (and have said this on many occasions) but soverignty is non-negotiable.
Argentina had/has two options, aggression or legal. This is the long and short of it!

87 JPL (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 06:31 pm
lost:Davidoff and his workers had all the necessary documentation, the “white card”, in addition to the British embassy was aware of all this purely commercial operation. The order of passing through seal Gritviken passports, unilaterally breaking the “communication agreement” of 1971, came after the landing of the workers in Leith, WAS NOT BEFORE THE ARRIVAL OF THE WORKERS. The “white card” (which had the workers, backed by the British Embassy), needs no sealing, and fewer still could allow their passports stamped. Here we see who breaks the agreements and commitments signed (the UK). And the threat of force to evict civilian workers, was what unleashed the conflict, because if Argentina did not do anything about it, was recognizing the “sovereignty” British (nonexistent).Argentina never planned the operation in April, let alone a diversionary actions in Georgia. If we think seriously, could never have planned Argentina making in April when he was about to receive 15 Exocet missiles, superetendards, and P3 Orion aircraft. Besides the troops had only a few months of instruction. The ideal operation had to be the last quarter of the year, not April. Argentina is inconceivable that force recovery of the islands in April, not counting the 15 or more Exocets they were about to arrive.

95 lost1 (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 08:47 pm
87 JPL
You are wrong, the scrap merchant saga is well documented, they themselves never denied it. Of course your version is the Argentine propagandised version aimed at the Argentine public, who being insanely patriotic will have believed every word. If you believe anything your military junta came out with, I have a house to sell you on the planet Mars!
I also don't get what your point is? Is it that Argentina was justified in invading the Falkland Islands and South Georgia because the authorities decided that a bunch of scrap merchants had to go through the proper channels in South Georgia?
Get over it JPL you lost. You was in the wrong. The Falkland Islands have never belonged to Argentina, they were settled before Argentina even existed. Regardless of how many hundreds of years you mad nationalists wish to go back in time, it doesn't work, you are simply incorrect.
I'm sure the German's believed Hitler, when he told them the Polish had invaded Germany. But the idea that a military junta, that had spent a decade killing its own people would lie to them seems lost on you!

97 JPL (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 09:15 pm
You are wrong, if the incident and the British threat to use force to evict workers from a disputed territory, if it had occurred during a democratic government, just as the Argentine government had been forced to act. If you did not, could lose forever the right to claim sovereignty. Obviously you do not even read the “report Rattenbach” or the employer's statements Davidoff, only based on information on the British side, just for that (not to consult different sources) would be equivalent to not approve a Master of defense in any serious college . Well, maybe in a “master's degree by correspondence” would approve.
Also, I repeat, Argentina was the country least suited him a military action in April. Since I was about to receive 15 e.x.o.c.e.t.s (among other things) and the troops had not completed the annual training program.

98 JustinKuntz (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 09:30 pm
JPL
No they didn't have the right documentation.
They didn't apply for the right documents, Davidoff lodged the application after they left. Despite the fact that the British still offered to bend the rules to save Argentine face.
The White Card provision was purely for the Falklands, Argentina sought a confrontation to widen its application and then pushed its luck further.

100 lost1 (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 09:44 pm
97 JPL
You seem to forget the invasion occurred at Easter, most UK forces had gone on leave just hours before the islands were invaded. While in Argentina, all leave was canceled. As I said before, the invasion was planned well in advance. Trying to rationalise the actions of a fascist military dictatorship that had the blood of tens of thousands of its own citizens on its hands makes you as bad as they are in my view. Argentina should have appologised to the people of the Falkland Islands and UK for the gross abuse of international law after your government was replaced and all the claims of neighboring territories (which has its history in Argentina's Peronist fascist past) should have been dropped too. If that had been done, today the people of Argentina and the Falklands would be the best of friends, the Falkland islanders living without the constant intimidations and threats from an irrational government!
1,000 dead servicemen, 2 civilians, Argentine war veterans treated with dishonour by their government, the population and their officers, 50,000 of your own citizens disappeared and still the average Argentine has blind faith in his government. All your government has to do is wave the flag and you will all come obediently to their bidding regardless of what they have done to you.

102 JPL (#)Sep 27th, 2011 - 09:52 pm
98 JustinKuntz: They had the correct documentation, as the British embassy never told the “civil entrepreneur” davidoff that “white cards” was not for South Georgia and the “communication agreement” of 1971 said nothing about it. Or is the British governor who was in the Falklands, had no authority in South Georgia?

107 JPL (#)Sep 28th, 2011 - 12:20 am
I think that you have not even read the “report franks”...The first military movement was made by Britain, not Argentina:
March 21: Departure from Port Stanley, the ship “Endurance” (with marines on board) to the South Georgia. March 23: the ship “John Biscoe” sets sail from Florida toward Malvinas (with reinforcements of marines) March 25: Departure from Punta Arenas (Chile) en route to the Falklands, the ship “Bransfield”. March 25: The destroyer HMS Exeter sailed from Belize toward the South Atlantic, and so on.
Margaret Thatcher, in a parliamentary debate in the House of Commons in late January 1983. At that time, admitted that on March 31 had given orders to seven warships heading to the South Atlantic but not act “while waiting for other ships that would soon be accompanied by an aircraft carrier.”
As everyone can see, the British movements were prior to April 2. Supported by the same “iron lady”

108 Islander1 (#)Sep 28th, 2011 - 12:32 am
JPL- John Biscoe and Bransfield were unarmed merchant vessels!! HMS Exeter did not leave the Carribean until late Apreil early May - she was still there in a public port when Arg claimed top the world they had sunk her of S Georgia!
Endurance was dispatched to S Georgia yes - AFTRE the ARA Auxiliiary vessel had landed Arg Marines etc at S Georgia!
Do get your facts into line first!
The invasion was indeed planned months in advance - hell your Antarctic area command officer deliberetley showed Endurance,s Captain a practise landing whilst on a courtesy call to Argentina(they were personal friends due to their respective positions)HGis words apparently were along the lines of”I hope you understand what you are looking at - as our superiors are out of control and tell yours as it needs to stop before we all have a disaster) Capt Barlow reported back to London - whose diplomats sadly ignored him.

111 Redhoyt (#)Sep 28th, 2011 - 12:55 am
JPL doesn't want to learn !
“ ... March 20th - the Endurance is ordered to sail from the Falkland Islands to South Georgia with 22 British marines on board.
March 21st - the Argentine flag is lowered but there is no sign of the Bahia Buen Suceso departing.
The British Embassy is informed that the Argentine naval vessel is not in South Georgia officially, and that the Argentine Government hope that the significance of the affair will not be exaggerated.
March 22nd - the Bahia Buen Suceso is seen to sail away but some Argentines have remained. The Endurance receives orders to remove the remaining Argentines....”
“ .. March 25th – another Argentine naval vessel, the Bahia Paraiso arrives at Leith.
Two Argentine frigates, with Exocet missiles, are deployed between South Georgia and the Falklands.
March 26th - the Bahia Paraiso leaves, but without taking off the remaining men who appear to have been resupplied.
Dr. Costa Mendez makes a public statement to the effect that a firm decision had been taken to give the men on South Georgia all necessary protection.
March 27th – the British Ambassador in Buenos Aires reports his fears that Dr. Costa Mendez has been less than honest with him, that the Argentines had been “playing us along” and that the Bahia Paraiso appears to have armed marines on board...”
falklandstimeline.wordpress.com/1982-2/

113 JPL (#)Sep 28th, 2011 - 01:30 am
Errors and more errors. Civilian workers landed on March 19, HMS Endurance leaves for the South Georgia on 20 March, and the Argentine soldiers who were to protect civilian workers, newly arrived on 26 March. In addition, the Biscoe part from Montevideo with 68 Marines aboard.
British military movements began before April 2, began on March 20 and continued throughout March, and preceded the departure of the argentine fleet which was to recover the Falkland Islands

119 Redhoyt (#)Sep 28th, 2011 - 04:49 am
No errors JPL - read the Franks Report ;-0
“ .. March 31st - The British Naval Attaché in Buenos Aires reports that virtually all the Argentine fleet is at sea.
Dr. Costa Mendez is widely quoted as saying that Argentina would not give way to threats of force and that the group on South Georgia was on Argentine soil.
Intelligence reports suggest that April 2nd is the day of ‘action’.
Admiral Sir Henry Leach advises the British Prime Minister that Britain could and should send a task force if the islands are invaded.
American President Ronald Reagan and Alexander Haig in Washington are informed of the serious nature of events.
HMS Endurance is ordered back to Stanley.
April 1st – The President of the United Nations Security Council formally appeals to Argentina not to invade and a message from Mr. Haig in Washington is relayed to Lord Carrington, saying that the United States Government will do all it can to help...”
falklandstimeline.wordpress.com/1982-2/

140 lost1 (#)Sep 28th, 2011 - 11:12 am
113 JPL
You come across as a totally brain washed mad Argentine patriot, wave the flag... yay.
The Bisco was carrying the planned relief detachment for NP8901, due to change over with Major Noots detachment on 1st Arpil, the Bisco would have returned Noots detachment via Uruguay had tensions not been rising. Only half of Gary Noots men remained on the Falklands, the rest having returned to the UK weeks before.
The total number of Marines on the islands at the time of the invasion was 79, this included the new detachment, this mighty force had at their disposal a couple of land rovers, a 4 ton truck and a collection of smalls arms, half of which didn't work!
If the UK was planning for war with Argentine, the intelligent thing to do would be dispatch half a dozen nuclear subs and take out the Argentine invasion fleet as it entered Falkland Waters! As it was all but one of Britain's nuclear hunter killer submarines were tasked on NATO patrols in the North Atlantic, the only available
You asked me if I'd ever read Argentine documentation on the war, yes I have, I've read most books on the war published in English and Spanish, I researched papers on the Argentine plans to invade the islands, which go back decades!
Here -
9th January 1981 - British Ambassador to Argentina lodges formal protest against unauthorised landing on South Georgia on 20 December 1981 by Argentine scrap-metal merchant Constantino Davidoff .
I suggest you read the book “Beyond Enducrace” by Captain Nick Barker, commander of HMS Endurance, which is an excellent book on the lead up to the Argentine invasion and goes into detail on the “scrap metal merchants” landings on South Georgia from 1981-82, the intelligence reports of Argentina's planned invasion from late 1981, the armed Argentine scrap merchants, etc.
Other books worth reading that give a good overview of the lead up to war are :
Official History of the Falklands Campaign vols 1 & 2
Reasons in Writing - Ewen Southby-Tailyour

144 JPL (#)Sep 28th, 2011 - 12:22 pm
British fundamental error consists of the following lies:
1. On March 19, landed soldiers and civilians. The reality is that they were only 41 civilian workers.
2. The civilian workers did not meet the necessary paperwork. The reality is that if they fulfilled the formalities, since they had the “white card” also valid for the islands Goergias. The British reported that they had to go through Gritviken after (not before) March 19. The white cards did not need any sealing. Much less could allow the passport stamped. We see here as UK unilaterally breached the “treaty of communications”, 1971.
3. The British official history says that Argentina made the first military movements, when the reality is that it was UK, since March 20 HMS Endurance from the Malvinas to South Georgia. Due to the threat of intolerable and disproportionate use of force to evict ordinary workers, the March 26, 1982, landed at Port Lei.t.h a group of Argentine marines (only armed with rifles) to defend civilians.

Although the British official history does not accept this, this is reality. And because they will never accept this and that Britain would remain as the aggressor, must resort to lies. It is not the first time that UK does.

146 Redhoyt (#)Sep 28th, 2011 - 12:46 pm
JPL- you are full of BS. Believing the lies told by your Government.
Davidoff was paid bythe navy - Fact!
Your version does not live up to the truth !!
falklandstimeline.wordpress.com/1982-2/

156 JPL (#)Sep 28th, 2011 - 03:08 pm
You do not have bad intentions, you are victims of the poisoning of his own official propaganda. British Lies is based on: 1) the March 19 armed soldiers disembarked, and as “proof” shown in all its documentary pictures of the ceremony that took place in South Georgia on April 2, celebrating the recovery of malvinas. A clear manipulation. 2) Davidoff did not fulfill the necessary procedures for purely commercial operation (this operation was not military). What is a clear lie, since they had the “white card”. UK unilaterally broke the “communication agreement” of 1971. 3) Davidoff did not work for the army (do not know who bought all the facilities abandoned in 1979 at the company “Christian Salvensen Limited”, prompting several commercial lawsuits against “British state” of the Argentine businessman?). And the military never infiltrated the 41 workers who landed on 19 March. Many were Spanish, Uruguayans and Chileans. British Embassy also had the complete list of all personnel. It's pure rubbish to justify British aggression to evict by force peaceful workers.


http://en.mercopress.com/2011/09/26/falklands-rockhopper-spuds-new-well-and-plans-another-drilling-slot
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MensajePublicado: Jue Sep 29, 2011 12:14 am    Asunto: Responder citando

Gracias JPL, la idea del autor que me cedió la posibilidad de "actualizar" su gran tarea investigativa es lanzar una segunda edición pronto.
De todas formas la que realicé está en PDF y puede bajarse e imprimirse tipo libro digital.

Te felicito porque yo ya he perdido la paciencia con intentar explicarles a los ingleses, es como hablarle a una pared.

abrazo!
Patricio

pd: tengo que hacerte llegar el diario en papel en estos días.


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AF



Registrado: 04 Jun 2009
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MensajePublicado: Jue Sep 29, 2011 9:46 am    Asunto: Responder citando

Menendez Never Surrender

Yo sei que es complicado para la gente comprender

primero no havia una guerra declarada

segundo Menendez asigno UNA TREGUA CONDICIONAL

y no un SURRENDER INCONDICIONAL

la razon por que Inglaterra ahora ocupa militarmente Malvinas lo cual vos prometo no sera por mucho tempo,por que de esta vez toda america latina viene por el DEGUELLO

y Inglaterra lo sabe,

los servicios de las fuerzas armadas de Argentina Brasil Venezuela etc no son estupidos

y van respectar ahora los tratados nucleares igual que los Ingleses y amaricanos los respectan

Argentina derroto los ingleses y hai sido el unico pais del mundo que lucharon solos contra

la OTAN LOS EEUU y INGLATERRA Y SUYAS COLONIAS Y LOS BILLDERBERGS

vos parece extrano pero los ingleses prometieron devolver Malvinas en el plazo de un ano en Brasil
esa mensage lo traia el Papa

por otro lado los ingleses secretamente iban usar armas nucleares contra Cordoba Falda del Carmen y Buenos Aires

por que se crian que los misiles atomoesfericos con ojivas nucleares estavan en Falda del Carmen

pero todos eses misles argentinos fueron movidos en la noche 28 de febrero de 1982 en plataformas disguizads como coches de ganado

ese articulo havia sido publicado antes de la censura de 99 años lo busco todos los dias pero jamaz lo encuentro

tan poco encuentro el otro sobre Reagan y el Vulcan con destino a Chile,que a sido obligado aterrizar en Brasil

hace 5 anos hakearon mi otra computador y destruiron todas mias fichas
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JPL



Registrado: 19 May 2008
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MensajePublicado: Jue Sep 29, 2011 4:13 pm    Asunto: Responder citando

El Malvinense escribió:
Gracias JPL, la idea del autor que me cedió la posibilidad de "actualizar" su gran tarea investigativa es lanzar una segunda edición pronto.
De todas formas la que realicé está en PDF y puede bajarse e imprimirse tipo libro digital.

Te felicito porque yo ya he perdido la paciencia con intentar explicarles a los ingleses, es como hablarle a una pared.

abrazo!
Patricio

pd: tengo que hacerte llegar el diario en papel en estos días.



Es que se ponen fuera de si cuando insisto en que la version inglesa es incorrecta, ahi comienza la lluvia de insultos, yo me pregunto entonces ¿ quien es el que tiene poca educacion ? Rolling Eyes

Vi lo del diario, ¿ es solo por suscripcion anual ? ¿ o se puede pasar a buscar cada numero individualmente por algun lugar ? ¿ 10 pesos + 4 de correo ? Very Happy

Un abrazo Patricio y felicitaciones !!!

JPL.
_________________
‎"La espada que se desenvaina con honor, se conserva inmaculada cuando hiere y mata, porque hace del sufrimiento y de la muerte servidores de la Justicia"
( J.B.GENTA )
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El Malvinense
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Registrado: 19 May 2008
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MensajePublicado: Vie Sep 30, 2011 12:56 pm    Asunto: Responder citando

si, cuando en un debate por el tema del portaaviones les dije ¿dónde quedó la caballerosidad británica?
ni si quiera sabían que significaba dicha palabra... y eso que se las dije en inglés.

-----------------------------
El diario no hace falta suscribirse, la ventaja con la suscripción anual es que se pagan dos ejemplares menos ($100 por los 12 ejemplares del año).

Pero yo me encargo de mandarte esta primera edición sin cargo, si no encuentro tu dirección te la pregunto por privado.
Y además estás invitado como siempre te digo, a que escribas sobre algún tema, ya que hay 4 secciones fijas: noticias malvinas, noticias veteranos, guerra 1982 e historia malvinera y nacional.

Se que las dos últimas seguramente tendrás muchos temas en mente...

Saludos!!!
_________________
"Tres cosas guardan la unidad: la paciencia, la humildad y la caridad."

http://www.malvinense.com.ar
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